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Triple Advantage
Triple Advantage

Season 2, Episode 15 · 1 year ago

Ep. 24 - Experience and Escapism

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

Welcome back audience to episode 24 of Triple Advantage! This week we cover some self analysis from the Royal City Society team, we continue our divination of the DMG, and address yet another Critical Thought. We also answer some community questions that we post on our instagram @royalcitysociety. 

As game designers we try to incorporate a bits of ourselves in the game world to add a sense of realism and connection for players and their characters. However, we do acknowledge that to subvert expectations at our table we need to continually step out of our own comfort zones and explore more diverse and complex themes for our games. This week marks the start of a longer discussion the RCS team will be having regarding the community we want to build. 

Wow is everybody excited for an episodetwenty four of triple advantage? I am welcome to your wonderful podcast toladvantage where three semi experience BMS talk about Deendi, as if we've hadtwenty five years of experience in the Crowt join us. My name is Carlos I'Mred, I'mJordan, Nthis week's podcast h where, if you'renew to the show M, we explore three different h segments, usually we'regeneral conversation about our daily, the and woes and thoughts Um. We are going through theDUNGEONMASTER's guide, H for the first time as DM, so to keep that with a grsalt. What it is we actually talk about inthis podcast and H. Finally, we are always thrilled to close out ona very thoughtful question from Jordan, our critical thought of the week Um sowithout further ado. Let me make aplug make sure you go check DM skilled for the fires below available now byRoyral City Society and let's hit into this podcast guys.This week, I've been thinking a lot about culture in general, M, veryabstract thought but um. I love to travel and one of the things that I'veseen myself do more at the table. Now is after Um going and seeing places first hand andsort of spending some time there. I like to incorporate it into Um my games,my tables for my peers. I find that it brings Um a livelier sense of atmosphere, but Iwas wondering burn and Jordan what, if any H, experiences like this? Have you guyssort of weaved into your storylines for your campaigns? Let'? Take it take it away, whoever h one of the one of the biggest things that I incorporated by, or rather into my homber setting, was Um, something that I think I made thissitting back in twenty eighteen in the first place and I as just kind of beenexpanding on it until I actually got to run the game earlieter last year. AH- and I think it's actually more relevantnow- was the idea of deviceive this and that's the concept we 're talking alittle bit before we were rolling about the current h, the current political climate in it'spublicized, a lot in the? U S, but also up here, a lot of racialization a lot of dividedness amongst a lot of people fora lot of good reasons in a lot of case, but that was something that I d juststarted, bringing more and more into my campaign. Personally, the the setting that I, AH, that I created kind of, puts all ofthese fantasy races on am a more level playing field than I thinkthey get a shake towards in Tradi N, like Tha, traditional players, handbooklike orks are supposed to be evil. For example, Goblins are not supposed to betraditionally good. Um hags are supposed to be a traditionally evil. Alot of these creatures that are thought of as traditionally evil ortraditionally good for ex for the opposite example, are not necessarily like. You can't reallyassume that anybody is or is not something just because of theway that they appear. That's something that always kind of bugged me about thebasic rules, and that's something that I wanted to change in in there but h. At the same time, I created the settingwith a lot of unrest at the time. They're kind ofliving in a period where yea anybody can do or be anything but there's stilla lot of individual persecution of these peoplebased on what they might be, and it was kind of designed as a as areflection of what what we live through in our society inNorth American society and probably H, others are on the world as well, which is I mean I I'm of two minesabout it. 'cause, it's a fantasy game and it kindo should be a bit of anescape from. I think the bigger problems inthe world, and I think that's why a lot of us play it is to kind of get awayfor a couple of hours from anything that's going on, but at the same time like it's, we werite from what we know like, which is.

I think, what you talk about CAS wereright, based on experiences that we've had andexperiences, that we've seen reflected in the different culturesthat we've seen and studied and been a part of. So I think it's something that kind ofjust naturally came up to something: That's Kindo, always there and is now being represented in this game. Interesting Um. Personally, I guess for my campaigns. I I lean more towards um, staying awayfrom things that are, I rl like real life stuff, just just because, like like BradonAsaing, like T, it is a fantasy game, it's it's and it's it's an escape for alot of people and that's definitely the case for me. I I I enjoy the idea ofbeing able to kind of put the world's problems behind me and just like Roeplay in a less turbulent world. I guess M or a turbulent world in in differentmanners M. I kind of purposefully stray away from the kindof things that you would find in h in our time today. Um, unless I am like,I could design a specific scenario or a specific campaign with a specifickind of setting, and I would have to go and talk to the players ahead of timeand say: Hey: Do you guys want to play in a setting that is like this? Where there is, you know, Um some sort of like you know: elbs verses,m humans, or something like that right, where it's like. There's this tensionbetween races or whatever Um, only only if the players agreed to something likethat, and they understood like this- is not indicative of anything going on inthe world. It's more just. You know. This is something that could be used asa form of m tension in the world in a form of Um. I guess campaign progression Um. So it's it's a story device right because for me I guess, D nd ends upbecoming exactly that. It's a story that you're building together and so Um.I don't like yeah bringing in anything that that comes from the outside world.I want it to be kind of the separate thing, that's kind of pure, almost to acertain extent, Um yeah. So that's that's where I kind ofland there. If I'm bringing anything in from real life, it would be like. OhHey I learned about this new religion. It has some pretty cool, um,interesting gods or goddesses or whatever, and that would be a reallycool character to bring into this. Or you know, Oh hey, like I met thisperson and you know they were acting a little bit crazy, I'm goingto use. Youknow this h experience that I had as a character device or or something likethat it wouldn't it wouldn't. It would never be like a main plot thing unlessI specifically designed it with the players in mind M and as I'm talkingwith them, I would have to talk through it and all that kind of stuff. So that's where I kinda stand on that. So it's interesting hering, your guyssanswer to this because, like you guys um the the way, the so the Exen, the way thatI phrase the question was intention: L A little bit vague Um when I think of this game space, for example, I like touse experience my own personal experience as a means to better connectplayers to the game um now. Both of your examples are methods of doing that which is um sort of resognating, with Um People's motives and this natural architype and stories ofgood versus bad right. It's a it makes it easier to determine you know what the propercourse of action is within a gamespace right, like what the success criteria,how the success criteria will be achieved in in a gamespace or in astory. But I guess when I when I, when Iinitially asked it, I was more so referring to things like Um, if you've ever been in a hot summer,beach or in a jungle, and how that feels and how you try to transcribethat into you know a...

...a ten on a perception check, um how youwould n corporate these little bits ofinformation. But it's interesting that you guys both answered in a similarmanner and I think it does strike it. It strikes to the Um twenty of our listeners. It strikes tothe utter importance of how you should h stay informed M, especially with Umthe vast amount of injustices that are Um occurring in the world. But it's I've been. I've been watching a coupleof more interviews, online and sort of trying to see how other creators hspecifically in the dunges and dragons media, are handling this, because a lotof the people that I watch are voice actors and Um. It's to me. It felt like a little bit of ofa gray area on how Um these people, who are portraying Um cultures tha. Obviously they deeplycare about rigtlike to become a professional and successful voice actoryou you need to dive right in and communicate and Converse D or at least listen and pick up theoddityis of dialect and M whatnot and how they're sort of transcribing that into a very sort of just representation in their campaign games,and, I think, Brin. What you said was pretty much Um like in line with whatmatmercer and H H, Branan sed in a potcast that I watched,which was just you, try to mix it all up and diversify it as much right likea hag, might not be m evil and I gotta say it was interesting becausewe played that just recently in your campaign on Friday. This was one of thefirst moments that I, as a player, Um, was exploring these avenues. Thesethoughts and a game like where you like how you saidat Jordan and it's uh, it's you know a bit of an escapism right like it's notsupposed to be the real world, but I think I th, I don't Wan ta. I don'twant to shit on your damming Braiden, but I, when we were at the bar when wewere when we were at that bar speaking to the the I forget her name that theentertainer Um I a I had an inkling to inside check what you was saying about.Like you know, it's the HAG. Oh it's a hag and it's interesting because one ofour other players Um the dreit o. The party also brought that up later on andit sort of you felt the party sort of pivoted slightly and how we approachedthe initial encounter. You know. Normally, I think we were planning it.Normally we tend to plan out everything like Oh we're going to go fight, a hag.How are we going to do it their spellcasters and like break out theplan, but it was interesting to see that that didn't happen and just thegeneral approach to that encounter changed ever so slightly, and it was definitely because most of the party Ifeel, is very again aware of the current political climate and thecurrent the current state of affairs in theworld and how we're all trying to figure out our place in this sort ofglobal culture, and I think we all had that thought at that moment where itwas like. Maybe our expectations are't, you know correct, maybe Li. It was interestingto see that or character at the beginning too, like it was very dopy,you know teen Ork, you know, like I don't know, I don't know how to doanything at the house and being bost around by his parents. Essentially Um. It was refreshing and it wasinteresting to see that and H. I'm excited to explore thes spacefurther at the table, and I think this this changes a lot between like Um, Ithink for us. The consideration is, if we're hoping to starting to includemore the community. How do we do this properly? You knowabsolute Um and I think it's important like how wedo and sort of start adapting our home games a little bit before. We Start Um advertising more and more, but I think it's interesting because Ithink of culture I think of I think of like ah traveling in Asia, or I thinkof like just the feeling of being in likea bamboo force like like how does it air field there's acold? You know it 's, like it wasn't terribly humid when I went so. I'vebeen trg like especially in the jungl campaign that we've been playing anchilt. I've been trying to incorporate a little bit of that feeling Um to theworld Um. But I don't know sorry this. Thisconversations cn...

...a couple of places. It definitely D,Yeah Ou, think about a lot of Yes towords towards the first conversationI'll say like I don't I don't want to jump on to lexum cancelD and dtrain, but that is one thing that is always really really deeply upset me about. Dind isthe idea that they do kind of pigeon whole races, specifically into good andevil sue and, like you were saying in Werewe, were playing in this campaignon Friday and Ar Paladan. Our friend Matt said when, when he had heard thatthey thought it was a hag that was doing these crimes in the town he waslike. So what would we know that hags were evil yeah and I was like t it?Would he didn't say? If it wasn't, would we know if haggs revalwould we know that hags are evil? It's it is becauseit is a known fact. In thedendivers S, this specific creature is evil, and that's just like our our reality, I think, is a reflectionof our art as much as ris, a reflection of our reality, like our influenceslife in a lot of cases. So when you're reading things that are specificallypigeon holding races, especially into good and evil, I don't like that. I don't like thatone bit and that's always been something that I've been trying to notincorporate into my own Games um towards your second point regarding theforest. Yo got methinking now cause. I don't travel a lot. You guys knowthat I hate trouble, I'm a very im, a very um stay in myhouse and not go further than downtown Kandagi Um, but also in my campaigns, maybe you'veboth notice Thisi. I stick to cities a lot. I really enjoy cities and Presentopeople with cities and when you're traveling sure you're traveling, butit's always between cities. Am I'm wondering if that's why I'venever really thought about that before d now, but I'm wondering if it'sbecause that's what I know like I can describe the city, I can describ tecityremarkably well, at's, really not much else. I know I bout cities, so Istick to it. I think, for the sake of this, we'reGOINGTO run a little bit longer on Thi segment. I think it's important too, but for the sake of the organization,th T, we clearly have two different points here that we're talking about.So let let's, let's continue a little bit on that first Um, that first point tat, firstyence aawith regards toraces, N dend. I think that I am Um. I think that a lot of that is becauseUm were the stories that I think the gameitself is basing itself off of started as m. Youknow these fantasy settings with good and evil forces, something that awriter like juren said use as a story device to drive. You know a book from front to finish Wwho are the heroes? Why are they heroes and the you can see it with Um likemore modern characters that are on the grey area? You know t like your deadpools of things where it's just okay, they're, like they kill bad guys, butthey're Allso, bad guys, Um, but they're funny. So I guess T's. Youknow what I mean: So's, okay, it's like Learit rentolds! It's like! I think I I I get that point and Ithink I see the importance when it comes to a story and when you're talking about the creaturesand adaptations of monsters that are created in the world of the nd Um, I think that it's largely based on their stories, like the stories of you, know,warewolfes, you know, and the stories of Um like Traqula and how that emergedright, it's again the character itself. If you read the book is very complex,largely they're luring people into their castle and kind of keeping themforever. And it's not. You know it doesn't dive with gooda general sense right. So I think the importance now in the game is: Do you shift, I think, do you shift the the expectations of your players? Great,I think you can definitely run a game where vampires you know, like Y, you,coal see it in t v now right, like my mom's, been bid watching vampirediaries right and these vampires are bad they're helping humans,...

...but you know they're also their way thlike the way that they've been doing. It is just about like staking eachother through the heart, so it's a generally non violent situation eitherand I think you're seeing little transgressions. You know now that wthey're, interacting with other h species, for example, and how thoselike interactions play out and it's interesting to explore those spacescreative and it's very important to explore those places creatively. Um, Iwill say it's it's a little bit of an of an interesting thought. Given thatUm there is a race of humans in the game and it's not like they're reallysegregated, like they would be in the real world by race. Rai Human ishuman. I think, given the space I'l say personally, like as as a DM andwatching everything transpire on the news. It's definitely gotten me to think M.maybe what kinds of characters I should portray M in my game or how I can bestportray them right without enforcing a bias, that's sort of been installedin culture for hundreds of years or Tryingo. You know, Ting were from thatneare yeah, trying to pive it away fromcertain things like that Um, but it it's odd, because I see itin a sense of it's a story and you're trying to tell a tale of escapism. Youknow where you can become a hero in this world Um and UH yeah. Like I mean it's just it'sjust interesting to explore that with creatures. You know that, like Vampiresand Werewles, it just feels like a very um ias at the EM. It feels like a verysa, like a a very safe space in general, to explore these more complicated ideas.Um that exists within the real world. I'lldefinitely say that it's a game Um, it's a very helpful tool that I like touse. When I try to explore things that I have conflict with Um, not conflict, ut. Sorry, I I don't be tsound, like I'm being too careful with my words here but um like I. It ideas that I, as a person,haven't fully figured out on my own, it's nice to be able to put them in agame, space and sort of pseudotest how five other people react to this andthen inform myself in a in a manner like that. I don't know Jordan. What do you think? Well, I'vegot two two kind of things here: Um. First of all, the game is a fantasy game, so youalways have to keep that in mind. So when we're talking about like creatureslike EGS and and your situation there where Matt was like, would we know if they are evil? The game was created, four people to become heroes, and ifyou're going to be a hero, you kind of need to know what is an evil action andwhat is considered a good action and you don't want to have people think-have to think too hard about these kind of things right, if you're, if you're,translating over everything, so ye anything can be good and anything canbe evil, then suddenly people don't know once again whether the whethertheir actions are considered good or evil, and so can Apalidin even go about you know in this campaign whereviolence is, you know, acceptable and where you know that's kind of like thenorm for Deinded, can they go about doing that and still expect to maintaintheir sadus as a lawful, good palated? I don't know, maybe maybe not. I thinkit would be really really hard. I think if you want to do something like that,where anyone can be anything and no matter what creature they are orwhatever, then you want to make sure that your players know that this ispart of your campaign from the very beginning so that they can anticipatethose kind of Um responses from from the World Right T.Yes, but I think that my main problem with that is that maybe that shouldn't be inherently assumed that everybody can'tbe everything right from the beginning, because I feel like I agree likeactions or actions, but I think Carlos said it best when he was talking about dead pool and the kind of idea of theanti heroes that like people, are complicated and were absolutelypossible to reconcile a villain that does both good and evilthings independent of what that individual is as a creature in the game.So I don't. I don't disagree that there...

...needs to be evil creatures and people to defeat in this game. In order to that, that'sthe narrative of the game. That's the game that Rin Ray, but I, where I disagree, is that thereneeds to be they need to give you a handbook andsay races. XWIAND Z are the evil people, so are demons always evil in yourcampaigns? Absolutely not! Okay! It's IT'S A weird case Righ! It's aweird story element because I understand where you're coming fromJordan in Aga and something because I think about this. I try. I try to thinkabout this all the time in the sense of how can I make it easier for my playersto play this game things like changing mechanics tobetter adapt their sense of the world into a Gamespace into this R PG gamespace and saying something like hey that person over there is being realbad to everybody around them and you guys are getting paid to makeeverything better in locations, makes it easier for the players to go hm okay.We should go stop that thing over there, because that is our goal right. It comes to the interactions, I think,with those with t the spaces in general, like how you introduce this settingright, because I think in Um incritical role. The second campaignright. I wasn't expecting Sam to play a Goblin, and that was one of the first timesthat I saw a Goblin in like a player character,rul the main hero of a story Um to GE there. How far? How far have yougote in the campaign? I mean, I understand that it's spoiler, so yeah general spoilers to everybody. If youhave, if you're, just starting a season to a critical rule, not is not what sheseems: Exactlyso Um, but but it didn't change the aspect tofTha Sury, because for the majority of it I assumed that right, Yeu was just going to be playinga Goblin and that's just what it was youknow M, but yeah. It definitely subverted myexpectations and it's not something that was so out of left field. Thatkind of made me question the story as a whole right, and I think, that's inpart because Ma made the entire wildmounsetting toincorporate an entire culture of races normally deemed bad Raden, their ownindependent society living their own independent world and the playerseventually reach that and it's not like they are shoeed out of the city immediately orattacked by any means they are able to interact with this entire group andthis entire culture of people Um. But again, it's weird because I also knowthat it's a fantasy space ral, it's it's Um this! The story is that youknow I might write into a campaign our sories that in my head are uminteresting to pursue and, like I said, they're inthings for people to say,like hey, how would a party of five people that have superpowers approach? The situation that aren't merigit's? Like I mean I might plan a story to go one way or another, but asa DM, it's important to always be flexible right and if your party isintent, changes throughout the campaign. It's your responsibility to Gnide thatattn into that success. Criteria and forgive and to deliver that feeling ofheroicness and goodness that I sense from yeah. I think I think itdefinitely comes down to communication with your players, making sure you'reon the same page as them, or at least they understand, where you're comingfrom so that again, so that they can anticipate the world that you're goingto be bringing them into right 'cause. I knowsome, I know some of my friends who well they wan t. They just want to beheroes and th t that's that's where they want to go and that's what theywant to do. They want it to be a little bit easy to be able to do that. So I'mnot going to try and bring in these really complicated people who are youknow easily definable like are are very harded define as good or evil. Theremight be one or two characters in there that are like Oh yeah. You can't reallytyl too much you player to handle it's two m payers who, like are barelyfiguring out, how to work their own character to figure ANCTHEANTRICACIS,another individual right, and it's like...

...a resognating truth right like it's one,where you as a person, you can't really understand somebody else until youunderstand yourself as well uwit, I ing parallel. I think UN, both a APyeah playing a lawful evil character in arealm where you know anyone can be anything would probably be the easiestthing for a new player to do. Then in that instance, because a lawful evilcharacter will be able to say this person did something bad. I slice themdown. It is justified boom done kind of thing move on. I do the same thing witheverything and anything that does that right, Um, whereas you can't you can'tdo that if you're a good character- and you see some good and some evil andyou're like mm- I don't know what what's right in this situation, inclearyeah think I understand at where brains coming from toolike you're, trying tobreak away from being put into one of these nine squares in the Grit RigtRightlike, I'm not lawful, good, all the time, yeah right, Um, so howd, but again, but again that thatkind of exposition no, but that kind of expesition when it comes down to aplayer. Ig is exploring that. Maybe you like do you as a DM when characters level up, say youralignment has shifted since your last level or something like that right,like rigtmake players, aware of their actions um or see. It's weird like may reflect your opinion on the playersactions so that they are updated. Perhaps, unlike Oh, I started out as alawful good character, but my DM's been keeping track of how many m bad thingshave done in game right. I think it S C it's a complicated mechanic to add rsure, and I think that that's why it'sjust easier to sort of wash away with th the sort of grid in general right L.Do you Mak slik our pernew players, especially for newplayers yeah and likeyou're, not going to make your player keep track of that, because wellofcourse I'm just GOINGTO keep sayin I'm awful good, but then also DM's perspective on thatmight not sit well with a player right at the end of the day. You think youractions are justified because the C, the person playing that character feelsdifferent about it, itgrates a complex space already, and it makes I think,like Wabraan said it makes it sort of irreletant at that point, right:everybody's th, the perception of what an awful good character is and how theyshould be played is subjective between player and DM in general right. So Iunderstand wherebran's coming from too ICO. Offuck do e even have it is that important at all rilike sureyour evens can generally just want souls, but if everybody ind your gamegenerally just watch souls because that's the setting, it's just collectsouls from people right. I don't know just somenar theme Ghost campaign whereyour job is literally just to collect souls. Well, that's not a bad action inyour community. I don't know two thoughts. First of all, I wouldlove to make that a Campir one hundred percent Plang, that's ateveryone's aater sa ve. I have at least ten minutes worth of thoughts on on the alignment chart. So I'll putthis out on air. Maybe we can move this to a bonus. Action were visonrgamot the Vigerid, the ALINEMATURT. Let's,let's talk about that and yea, I think it's definitely a topic that we canfurther explore. Um and well. I think it's important for usto Um. I mean we're trying to build acommunity and I think Um. It's the best place to get an inputfrom our community on how M we should best build this for them. You know so, let's pivot a little bit again, just to close out the last little bitof this longer segment but Jurdan any physical, sensations andexperiences in that space that you've incorporated in your ide decampaign.You know for for that section. I have to say. Actually I usually don't use myown experiences. I have other Tan like Oh hey. I watch this DM.Do it this way? One Time Oh, Hey, I watched you know I heard about this guydoing this one time or oh hey. I read this book and it described this muchdetail and you know I'd bring that into my games. But if I'm thinking aboutpersonal experience honestly, I don't have enough to be able to go off. Of Imean like yes, I live every day, but no, I do not have enough to say. Oh, I felt the wind this day or oh, youknow like I just don't. I don't pay attention to that kind of thing. Iguess in real life, whereas I'm forced...

...to listen to it when I'm listening to aDM or or reading a book. So that's where my descriptions come from, oreven like what does twenty dexterity mean in a character? I don't know whatthat looks like in real life. I'm going to pull that from. You know a book thatI've read or Oh, hey. Look. It's Spiderman he's ridiculous. He moveslike crazy. That's what twenty dexterity looks like or more. You knowwhich is funny. You say that because I feel like some players would totallyresonate with. It was a shadowy overcast night you felt the fog clingto your skin blah blah blah, whereas maybe you play at the tale you're likeComon Toem. No, I actually enjoy it craveryer Ienjoye those but M. I don't know like I can feel it more from someone elsedescribing it or if from reading it in a book than I can in, like as I goabout my normal everyday life, I just don't think about it. It's just it'sthere, so I it doesn't come up as like Hm. What does the air feel like rightnow? IWOULD have to actually think about it in order to be able to grabany details from that experience and put it into my Dan deeworld aeery Britant I's terrible. No, listen! We all guess we all get it.We all get our inspiration from somewhere, Rightso yeah like if it's from books and ifit's from novels that's a totally valid place to pull out for your game Ig.It's the things that youare interested whereare, you goin to say, Fren, Um,nothing too much of what besides Gavarie said I'll I'll agree with Jordan. I do um tend to pull a lot of. We've talked atdifferent times on the on the potcast about how we pull from fantasy settingsand whatnot and how we pull from what we've read and what we've watched Um and absolutely I am coming at the theKoren of writing side from more of a place of that and Moa than my experiences in the real world, butyeah when you, when you talk about Um descriptors, I think that it is a loteasier to describe somewhere that I've been verses somewhere, that I've read about N. I'm really. I really a'm thinkingthat's why everybody's constantly insit you're never leaving cities. This isthis is when o r i's an urban campaign. It's all one bigcity we're in Rahacou now well, I've mentioned my one of minebefore which was um like the feeling and the experience of actually being in aplace, but the two other ones that I really enjoy, and I haven't reallyexplored too much in game. But with I'm going to and and I want to are foods H,foods of the World Um. Some of them have some interestingtextures. You know, and I feel like it's that kind of thing, or that'smaybe hard to pick out on a book Um like the a combination of flavors Umto me, you gotta taste it h, but the other one is voices, and I know that I I would tryto do that a little bit more of like having more distinct voices in and th the Games, I'm running, but I I spent some time in Europe lastsummer and one of my favorite things was just listening to my friends whoare M. also native Spanish speakers. Speak fluent German and speak h amongst one another we had we had thislittle moment. We were at a lake where the languages of people were Fluentinwere English, German and Spanish, and there was about seven of us that had amixen match of all of those right. So the M, the some of the significant others that myfriends had from in Germany that they met in Germany spoke fluent German andEnglish. My friends spoke fluent Spanish and German, and I spokefluen Spanish and English, butno German. So it was really interesting on how everybody was just talkingamongst one another, because there sometimes there was there needed to bean inbetween person to communicate right, and sometimes there didn't like. There wasone person there who only spoke Spanish, so they always almost needed to havelike a throuh person to communicate, but in general everybody else spoke somany languages that there could be like three conversations going on at thesame time, all in their respective language, and I felt I wassuperinteresting to be a part of- and it's I don't know it's like it's likeyou said Jourin. It's one of those...

...experiences that I like to sort of pickout and see and working that into a game where now like,I think we've had like how many languages and to of annihilation andgenerally speaking, We'e we've been moving through from one to the other,to you know an older language to an older language, but I'd love to explorea setting where I could just once, I'm more comfortable with these voices totry and explore, like that. Oh Shet, there's like a big gap here of how wecan communicate right because, usually everybody speaks common. But what, ifyou speak, broken common? So on o speak, you know, brokeand Elevisi. Can youkind of know: ellish! That's 'm, I'm Goin T bemore a I haven't been able to because wehaven't been in an urban setting, for example right the party's largely beenwith themselves. They tired Tim, so hat's, something that I'm reallylooking forward to introducing in Acampaigne, sometimes soon, but this segment has ran much longerthat it normally does, and I think it's time for Breedon. Do you have the thing I have? I havelots of things. Erness so yeah, first of all, as the as the sound editor slush behind the scenesproduction part of triple advantage and and a significantly lazy person, thisis just going to go long, secondoble. Let's take a quick look at this week inour community, because we have been trying to get some more communityengagement and some more questions out there to the people and you the people.Our listeners have responded. Thank you. We had several people respond to aquestion based off of our uh conversation last week, and ourconversation last week was: What do we look for in a northern setting? The first answer that we got came from our goodfriend David at Tegepta power plant on Insrigrim, who said what does that evenmean? And once I broke that down anddescribed that we're talking about far north campaigns such as, I think, like our degresion, he saidwhat he wants to see is mad macstyles, slay choses. Yes, yes, strong agree. Yes, I wasabsolutely love to see het. I don't know what you guess. It would be pretty cool, just a the chaos. Yes, our good friend at Tyler, DaogOnisgriam, that he wants to see theseen most other kin came forest good old, elph reference, neither from at Valhala at your boy love thename. First of all, that's that's prilant s. He wants to see stormchasing tribal, sled Vikings. We can mix that with the mad maxileoth thoseat the same time, if you ever want to write this drop us a line at Vajala atyour boy, we will we will work with you on this.We were excited for the concept Um carrless, your response to this. I Iloved actually and that was m a lush jungle with a hidden temple. I, likethe I, like Thi subversion of expectations, the idea that you go upnorth looking for the looking for the ice and snow and then all of a suddenyou were in in a jungle. My M, my whole thought was what, if theworld's north wasn't cold, that's a good inte, elso good! You! You made last week'squetion. What dare you doing, throring to or COPETS WAN it? No I'm done withis moving on. Let's look at the let's look at the DMGUm so last week we started getting into h planes and what the different planeslook like, starting with the Astro plane talking about the astrol sea andtalk about how it's kind of literally a regular, see and also not a regular seaand also there'r psychic damage, H yeah. But this week we're going to betalking about the ethereal plane. I think you need to read that littledescription at the top, the the from the shadow storm Yeah Tamlen, felt a hand on him felt hisbody Shimmer into mist. The screams and shouts sounded far off the walls aroundhim appeared to be only gray, shadows, reveilen and Brenu stood beside him.The ethereal plane REVALANC said the dragons immediately invokes thoughts of theblank spell for Sarters, as I believe that's what the Blak spell does isn'tnot you're transported O thaethereal plane. Yes, I mean in this case itseems like he's taken somebody to the theroplane with him. Yes, it would be the trealness spell, but Ibelieve that's like is that seventh or eighth oe, it's pretty high up yeah Um. So the Natal Quan is defined as amisty or fog bound dimension.

If you can call what it has on theoutskirts of shores Um, they overlap with the material planeand the other inner planes so that there is a coresponding location on theETHEREOL plane for every position on the material plane, O think thinking abit of an overlay situation. Here you know what that kind of preminds me ofdid anything D. An ever read the gun, siner series- STU! No! No! Oh! No! I didn't, I don't know uh the the third book. Drawing of thethree begins with Rorland at of beach, and just it had like one of those likememory flashes of mminteresting setting to put this in Um visibility is severely limited in theethereal Plin um sixty feet of most reduced down to thirty. In some placesit mentions some locations that you can enter via that being the plainshift spell awith limited success in terms of wornating how to get where also theAsgordan metioned the ethereal. An this spell Um, so imetches the boulderethereal, which is these shores that we are talking aboutkind of where they can see into where the plain overlaps, but the plane appears muted andindistinct colors blurting into each other. The edgeis turning funny fuzzy.Sorry immediately, who here is played bioshakin finish, Nope Carloss? I bought it on Nigt summer sails solong ago, thfirst off hands down one of the best games on herplate. If You'e, if you've playedbioshockingpin listeners hit me up on my personal account at Abrufins Brolog,we will raive for hoursbut a can. I spoil a little bit O. I don't know howmuch you guys know abut o for it, so th the game focusis on Brooker, the witchwho's, a detective kind of H, thirties, forties era, out of norstyle, detectiveUm, being tasked to very very vaguely you're, not really sure why yourmotivation is to to bring bring us. The girl wipe away the debt is his UH ishis motivation and the girl being Elizabeth Somebody who's being held inthe H in this fictitious floating city ofColumbia. This kind of utopia with a lot of really dark secrets, but Elizabeth has this power. She canopen tears. Terrors are essentially these veryfuzzy. If you can think of like Super Old Television, black and white and allraniat out of focus, that's how these tearors appear, so you run into tearsin the world and she can open them and what they essentially are is heropening dimensional doors. So, if you're running out of Mo, she can opena dimensional door to somewhere and they overlap exactly so. Your locationin your dimension is the same as the location on the other side of theterror is just a completely different dimension mm. Ah, so she can reach inand grab Amo for you and grab supplies for you from this other dimension andtoss them over to you kind O, taken up a role. Is Your sidekicked, but that's immediately what I thought of when I was looking at, then I thought the idea that yes, sirrygoed. Sorry, I thought about H, NASGULS and shadows of Mordor that Dame havenothat was where my headwent. It's kind of like a spirit. Almost realm right, where you're halfin half out righte, you can kind of interact with the world,but mostly you just pass through it. So Um, that's interesting, yeah, Nawschools from Ford of the Rings, I think, is a good example of someone that'slike in the ethereal realm. You know, that's why Phrodo can see them when heturns it when he puts on the ring or whatever, but everyone else. Justkindof sees this invisible fish creature with a cloak on, and you cansee that when the creature stabs foro the damage sort of cuts through moonbroms as well, exactly yeah thesirfom hero talks about the deepethereal, which is essentially if, if the Boarde athereals kind of Wer, ittouches all these other planes kind of these greeny little areas to passthrough the De pathereal is the ethereal plane. It is dark, it is covered in mist its. It is the Irplane essentially M, andwhat interests me is that H, scattered throughout the plane, are curtains ofvaporus color and passing through a curtain leads a traveler to a region ofthe border ethereal connected to a specific innerplane. Ahthat reminds me...

...if you've seen the movie, it might beof t e, less impact Harry Potter, either of you which, what Waare the Phoenixpotter? What e y have you got there orciics yes had Jordan eview I've watched the movie,I haven't run OVI I and in Carlos they have a better descriptiore of it in thebook than in the movie. In my opinion, in order F, the Phoenix in that finalscene, spoilers of Su somehow still haven't seen this movie anybut seted, was that any nonmillennials out here, Okid um, but h. The idea of the veil. The veil, is whatserious ends up falling through an ends of disappearing into noncorporialness.Essentially, the veil is the veil between this world, thematerial plane in Harry Potter in the next world. That's kind of what I'mreminded of an I'm wondering. If it's something similar, I mean it could be act like hey git,like a spirit round Henya half an half hour in in. I I think in Harry Potter.It more alluded towards the fact that it was kind of the land of death moremore blodly than this. But that's that's really the VIB IM getting here,I'm wondering if that's possibly a source, that's jakie really would havedrawn from when she was ready that a but ether cyclims. Let's talk about that'cause I like how much they go into kind ofencounters on what to expect. Besides just the topography of the planesthemselves, Um, it's exactly what it sounds like it'sit's a cyclone. They appear in the ETHEREO plane. They are apparently very tougt todetect by the sounds of it. You need to pass the score of at least fifteen toactually have any kind of warning M and let's see they can extend the journey, extendyour journey through the ethereal plane by a certain amount of time. They canblow you straight to the bordererthereal of a random plane oryou could be hurled straight into the astro plane. Awesome Akscat ye encounters. It sounds likeit's most of what you would actually expect from something called theethereal plane I ghost or able to move freely between the ethereal material. Anything where their senses orabilities extended to the etheroplane at mentions face spider, specificallywhoot kind of Blinkin, H, t out of existence, so I guess they're travelingthrough the material plane, as they do that Um other travelers being the primary the primary people that you would bebattling similar to the Astro plane, you're, going to come up against peoplethat are also traveling through Um, although it mentions it as particularlyone for the inner planes, and my first thought when they said traveler waslike other people like you who are just kind of passing through on your way tosomething that it mentions: elementals, genies and Salamenders and interesting. I don't I don't. Idon't read the Mostermanual as much as I do 'cause. I don't want to spoil toomuch of anything in case you guys decide to throw something at me. M Salamander Strikes Meisa yeawhat. Whatis the salamander in Fivi Phyllis Ball, O fire, obviously es actly it not. I think it's like a cousin of thedragons, essentially obut. I think they might be more related to the Plaine of fire. I'm not entirely sureon that, though. Sother they're, a large elemental, okay 'cause, I thoughtSalam Anders and the first thing I thought was you know a salamander orlike Im, all lizards, so ower like some vursion of a small lizard that has some,I don't know I've like kind of like Pogamon, like they probably Hav, somelike fire or o yeah. I was US like Y H. I was reading like hire. Sal manershave been associated in my hap for Oh, absolutely, yeah. Why? I just like arest list thatwas just like you know: elementals these great and powerfultitans of primarial matter, genies, the magic renting lords of their own planes,Salamanders onof! These things is not like theother. Yes, I thinksorry go it. That's like the UM. I Tak the firenates that you guys faced antimonnihilation back in Rahamer, okayy. So why would an elemental go throughthe ethrial plane, though, or the etheereal they're bound they spell so yeah like Iimagine, fire elementals natively live...

...on the Um Elementioci or whatever their respected,elemental, plane y. When I think of like a spell, it could be like aNarrato summoning thing right, like this jar, contains a trapped, Um, air elemental, for example, and it'sbound to the jar. But if you were to banish it, it would disappear to the hplan of the air or, whatever you know right O. Does it travel through theethereal plane in order to get to the material plane and then back if youbunish it, I think that that's maybe, where you put your ethereal plane rightlike what your description of this thereal phane could be 'cause if they,if all the planes are connected, like the Super Highway by this rtan SharpRay neg go stirrit and finds its gate to like the banishment spell, could bekind of like um the UM. What is it the PR? No, what is it from for the HItolea? Oh O, Wot Rom. What are you OI Fross, the Byphros yes Y, like the BuyFrost, R and it's like, and it just like, pushes you across all the planesand you travel through the astro plan, a the ethereal plan back to you knowthe elmeval plane of fire or whatever it pushes the creatures through it. That's how I I do like the thought oftheethereoplane as some kind of a a communicativel, because theastroplane we sel was between the inner planes and the Oterplanes, and thiskind of seems, like a dimensional, like Carlo, said, super highwayconnecting the innerplanes yeah. I layout I like that a lot raerty. I always connected the byfrost with theAstro plane more than the ethereol plane. I would tend to agree with that.Yeah, that's true! Yeah whateverbod, its yeah. I don't have Yo want if I has a DMCI R plane tack, but that that's pretty much ourconclusion of dividing the DMG for this week, listeners at home. What did youthink? How do you handle travel within thetherea plane in its planes? Have you played bioshock infinite, anddo you want to talk to me for the next? Eight hours about it, let us know atRols's society on Instegrem and Stordan. I believe I'll turn it over to you withit sure all right, I'm going to go with the pretty quick, critical thought fortoday, 'cause. We are running a little bit over so the time what Ao Youtawe're not constrained by time at this pot guest really constrained by anything ofErguess, we cantrwe make our own, and normally we keep it to about an hourfor or listeners soo that is, that' n is, if you had other scheduledprogramming, we're Horne. Yes, all right! Well, in that case Um,I think I'll still stick with this one. What o you guys Um think about higher and lower level characters,which one would you say is more fun than the other do. Do you have apreference? Do you think that higher litlecharacters are more fun than lowerlaw characters, because I think so? Welllisten! I love starting an new campaign, oifelow levels, but as a player, youdon't really get to do much outside of I attack Agat, like a lot of combat, will boil down tooh, even as a fighter, I've burned my action, suarge Um guess I'm stillattacking it's more option to play as a higherlevel character, but there is an intrinsic Um, a feeling of playing a lower levelindividual. Absolutely, I don't think it's as fun, though I don't think it'snearly as fun Um unless you maybe inform the player oflike some Orld knowledge like if they know, maybe how to interact withgoblins in a certain manner other than just hack and slash. Maybe that couldexplore some really fun H, H Games, but for the most part I thinkyou'd t boil it down to. I pick up the wolf and I throw it at another enemybecause I don't know what else to do right now, the record you know who you are andyou're listening that wasn now was not the right thing to do I'll. I don't have a definitive answerfor this. Just 'cause I haven't, played a ton of upper level characters.Atanwhat, do you think I'll say this? We've all played s Siv five mhm,there's, there's two verdistinct...

...phases of Sive. In my mind, that'SAStwo faces when you're playing and when you know someone's going to win, butyou still need to wait. Forty minutes Yeah Yeh. I I play some. I play some Solo campignsometimes so I obviously there's all the different uh errors and stuff, butIV break it into kind of two phases of the game, the last of those phases being onceyou're already firmly in trench- and you know everybody and you're all kindof in this arms race and you've got all these options available to o 'cause.You've got all these tech all this tech that you have in all these uh socialpolicy. So what route are you going to take? What are you going to do thistime? How are you ing approach of this battle? Where am I going to build nextwhen I make obild next and then there's the introfase and the interface is like?Okay, let's, let's, let's thow it on a city? Let's see how that works, at's,it's explored of the left. Let's see how that goes. Let's, Oh, there's a newthing. I've never met them before that's cool mom and I kind o like thatpiece. I kind o like thats explord of Pacte, where it's like. What can I do? What is available to me? What what do Iknow and what don't I know, what do I still need to figure ut, but I think Ithink Yo. I think tha, that perspective is definitely different because you arewanting to explore that world as a solo player, verses, Um, what you can explore in thistheoretical world Wi within a party as a player, I think yeah- maybe maybe I'm maybe it's a poorcomparison. I also I don't play donthink. I Ju t think there's a bit ofa distinction between the mechanics of like a solo, R, Pgr Solo Strategy, gamem 're, just like in general as Solo gamethat you are playing to progress through verses, a game where you have a a story that can can beexplored. I think it's just a little bit different, maybe way that you thinkabout exploration, because as a as a player right, the exploration that youhave is based on what your DM has prepared for you or has available toyou. So it's not like Um. You have a GE like, like maybe with the betterknowledge of the world you can make l, then that's kind of what I was sayingbefore Lik, maybe with better like player or character knowledge withinthe world, you could explore some different avenues in starting areas,but normally it's going to be like hey quest, starter, you know, like RPGGames, normally give you that initial quest to your character goes. Ohthere's something else over there. Okay, Sue! Let's go explore there right, it'snot so much Um! What's all around me because I have youknow this third party perspective of what wh what the environment is orsomething I don't know, but I get what you're sayin I would. I would alsoargue, though, that exploration doesn't have to be linure or one dimensionallike explaation doesn't have to be literaly. Let's explore the world, I'mthinking more like what what do I know at the avle level, one knowledge wisereversinall, the window at level, Twente, there's, probably a hugedifference in like if I were to role at twenty at level, one and twenty level.Twenty. As to what I know about a subject, I might get some verydifferent responses: Thought of a Gooencomer, okay, imagine running a lowlevel or a high level one shot, but you don't tell the players what they needto do. Okay, if a stage there's an issuesomewhere, but you don't tell the players right. The way that you do that as a DM,is you feed them information as they interact with people, but if like itwould be kind of hard to just all right you're in ICEWAND, Dale, H Wat. Do you ear? How did we get here? Why are we here yeah? I guess I was definitely thinkingmore long form campaign versus one shot's for sure uh, but yeah. I see what you mean Mjordan. What do you think? I agree alittle bit with both of you. I personally prefer the higher levels,but that's because I think I'm more combat oriented when it comes to the NDSO. I enjoyedthe versatility that comes with being a higher level character. In that Hperspective, I also enjoy like the different creatures that you're able totake on and interact with and not necessarily have to be like okay. Well,I'm a level one character. If I ever come across a dragon, you know I runaway, because I literally cannot do anything else, and if I do, I will die right Um, whereas, if you're a aslightly higher level, maybe you find a way to slow down the dragon or you finda way to like cover for your allies while theymake a break for it or maybe you're high enough level to finally take on adragon. You know I find that more...

...interesting guess than the lower levelsgenerally speaking, but there is something to be said of h, lower level characters because I,like you, said Bratan. I call that, like the developmental phase almos,where the player is learning about who they are as a person what is available to them in the worldand M, you know how they can be an influence in the world and almost likethey start training right away right it. It's that training Montosh. That getsyou to the point of the big battle so Um. I enjoy lower level characters from arole playing perspective. I guess because you're allowed to make mistakes,and you can learn a little bit once you're a higher level character. It'salmost like your character should be at least a little bit set, or at least alittle bit more firm in what they believe and what they should and what they know of the world andwhere they should go and that kind of thing Um. So that's where it would be interesting,though, to see a campaign like that, where maybe you as a DM just introducethe characters and let them figure out what they need to do were. But again you need to inform thecharecters like hey. Maybe your character knows the blacksmith upsalike upstate, and you need to Um your Pr. You have a personal goal, youknow, and you kind of force the players totalk and divulge information, but each other, and that sets the ball rollingfor labut. It's a little fine line where you still need a little bit of anangle. You know ecause otherwor, you don't want that ball just sit flat onthe table. It's Gotto go somewhere. Otherwise, peoe are going to be likeallright yea, please. What do yeah personal goals are actuallysomething an interesting topic too, because they at higher levels. You should be almostkind of completing those personal goals, whereas at lower levels, you're kind ofsetting them and you're saying huwhat do I do want to do with this character?Where do I want to be in? You know, five years time when I'm now level,eleven or whatever you know, y e you're kind of like trying to setthe stage almost and for someone to pull off a personal goal. Early on inthe campaign is well pretty pretty unheard of, I think onwhat. Ifyour oal was just to be a member noer of Thejo Yeh, maybe maybe you can do that. I heard itvre prestigious access. Yes, did you guys have anything else youwanted to add before I close US off here? No, I think that that's good, a pretty short episode of O on a patchat a bit true. Well, thank you. Everyone for forlistening this week. Um Hit US hit US up on instrogramt atRoyal City Society. Send US messages about what you think about higher andlower level characters. Wherean, you know, where'swhere's MM. Is it morefun? A higher levels are lower levels and what have your experience has beenum? Finally, I look forward to a potential upcoming, a character I guess or sub class comingup from from new warlonk futere and lookforward to a new warlock patron b. t those who are yeah s kind of class you'll enjoy this n team's beenworking hard at it exactly upcoming, soon we're notentirely sure on the date yet, but soon M, probably before twsend an twenty one, all right, all RIA facthan. Thanks for everythingand we'll see you guys next week.

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