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Triple Advantage
Triple Advantage

Season 3, Episode 7 · 2 years ago

Ep. 35 - Evil Abounds

ABOUT THIS EPISODE

On this episode of Triple Advantage, we discuss the frosty topics on DM's Guild, Jordan takes us down to some of the more spoopy planes, and we discuss what makes a good villain in this week's Talk of the Town.

Note: this episode has been re-edited due to audio errors in the first 10 minutes.

Today's episode of Triple Advantage, join your three notorious dms as we look at the frostiest topics on DM skilled. Then Jordan takes us into a spoopy territory by diving into the abyss, Cursera, hate and Gehenna. Then Britain discusses billains with us the most memorable, powerful whatever the society had to say. Stay tuned to listen. As always, make sure you follow our socials to stay in the loop of the conversation. Enjoy the show. Hello everybody, society members, we told you we expected this, but ice windale content is do be poppin this week on DM skilled. Britain you brought this to my attention, and we have the top three best selling hunder five dollars are all ice windale companions. AIDS FOR DM's are not one shots, which to me is a little expected because you know you have the entire adventure next to you. But interesting that players are looking for more content on ice when Dale, even though it was just released. Do you guys think that it's not filled with as much information on the geography and background of Ice Whindale's players are looking for now? And what do you guys think of. What do you guys think that that means with regards to how the player based or e is changing as the game progresses? Just look at it from a slight the companion stuff. I would assume that the players would not need to get them. Okay. Secondly, this is a campaign book, Yes, not a world book. That correct? I believe so, but I do think, Carlos, maybe you know a little bit more. Again, I've been trying to not to read too much into the book. We're actually picking it up and reading into the book. But I believe it's both. I don't think it's on the level of chult where it's like here's like a whole new continent. Have on right, but there's not a lot of existing information on ice, whindale, the location right, on ten talents, on this stuff. So Ex DEP is cortan. One of the companion guids is contains, for examp apple DM notes, sample plot lines. Yeah, expected difficulties. Another one has cheat sheets for ice, when Dale, places of interest, a bigger table on willderness encounters. And then you have running chapter one foundry actually virtual tabletop ready and counter maps, which is really cool to see. Something that I wanted to tell this. Yeah, is actually something that I want to talk about, but we'll get to this in a later episode. But yeah, go ahead, Jordan. The only thing that I heard there that is concerning to me is the chapter one or how to run the chapter one, because what I'm hearing then, other than that, is they've written a campaign that I hope is good enough that the actual plot line to it is fun and enticing and is something that the DM's are like, oh, this is really cool, but I want to know more information surrounding the area and like, like you said, a lot of the information there has to do with like different places that are think better. There maybe different types of encounters that you can throw at them, that kind of thing. But if the campaign, like the plot line, is created in a good enough manner, then then that's what should be included in that module and then they build the world around it right. So what that extra information might be is just the DM's going. I want more information written about this stuff so that I know how the world is run. But technically you could run ice when Dale without it and you wouldn't have to know all that, like all the different continental arrangements and things like that. So for child if it's anything like like. I'm mostly going off of the stuff that I've read, which is hoard of the Dragon Queen and really just wild mount other than that. And Wild Mount is a...

...like world built world thing. So it doesn't have a lot of campaign in it so much as it has a world built into it and then you have to go and make your own campaign for it. Hoard of the Dragon Queen was a campaign that felt like it didn't have a world surrounding it. So I'm guessing that this is the same here for Ice Windale. If it's a campaign module. So the DM's would want to go and look for that world aspect of it so that they can place it into their own campaigns or so that maybe they don't have to do the extra work involving like other random characters and places of interest, etc. Yeah, yes, I agree, but at the same time I agreed that hoard of the Dragon Queen didn't have a ton of information about the world around it. HMM. But the world around the hoard of the Dragon Queen Campaign and the follow up tyranny of dragons is the swords coast, and with start has a full swords coast compendium where you can write all about the world exactly when they allowed. But the effect copnions would be for right, for sure. But but here's so far in. When they introduce new locations like the sorts coast and like Cholt and like Borrovia and curse of Straud, the the module, with the exception of sorts coast because they already had a pretty existing module all about it. The module will contain the relevant information in order flesh out the world around it. Hoard of the Dragon Queen and tyranny are a bit of an exception. As one. They're the older modules. There I think the oldest looking a herd of the drag Queen. HMM. And to like I said, the information already existed in an official capacity, so there was no real need to rerelease it alongside the book. Here we have something that's not been fleshed out, not been discussed beyond this source book. To an extent there is like, let me see it, there is cot mas a bit throughout the people just really like it and want to know more. Just really like what the campaign module like. If you're really interested in something, and sure campaign modules give you the necessary information, but there's always stuff that's kind of left out. There's always more that can be put in, you know. So if people really enjoy this stuff, maybe they just want you know, all this could be really cool. Let's add some more stuff in here. What else is there? You know, I think that in general, this falls in line with what we've seen with other modules that have come out. Right like a it's the hot buzz word, so it's likely that all these chapters and releases from people are getting more cliques in general. But then looking at it from a different perspective as well, here, when the the assumption that is being made in this case is that the official release from wizard of the coast is not as fleshed as it should be. Right like that, the that there's details missing, and this is why players have to be looking for MS external sources of content for it. But in general, right like, what's the difference between this and the youtube videos that are definitely going to come out about how to run these encounters and how I that more experienced Dm am telling you, guys, the audience, how to run these encounters? Right, it's it could have been a very easy step that this channel could have taken. In general. You know, we could have had more segments of like regarding that kind of content. So this doesn't really it. This is kind of in line with that, right, like all these released modules down on paper. Are just more people interested in this module, generating more content that will you know, that, yeah, that other people might enjoy and at home, billy, it makes it easier for DM's to run the thing base exactly right, like it's yeah, now and in this case right like we have again. We talked about this last week, but we have licensing limitations where all these people would not be able to release any of those anywhere else except for DM skilled, right. So that also plays a huge factor in this trend. But the the thing that I that sort of stuck out, stood out to me was that that, by and large, it is a lot of DM's, God, so there must be more dms buying content for them right the now, this might be an inherent thing, because players aren't going to look at DM skilled to find more, you know, character content, but there might just be a bigger interest in dming now that the game and that the player base is grown as well. We're just kind of exciting. I'd love...

...to run a full DMS game one day. I think that'd be super cool. But yeah, I guess one of these things is that will have to keep watch on these trends as well. All right, like if this becomes a case for the next release and the next module, I wonder what kind of little spinoff articles are going to come up for a Tasha's caulder of everything as well. But yeah, it's a it's been an interesting little little ride so far with iceman Dale. I think it's definitely been like the they marketed this quite heavily. You have a lily compared to the other ones, in my opinion, and it makes more sense. I think you're just trying to grow the audience even further. But where do you guys think will we'll go next? Where we've gone north, we've gone south for Chalt, across the water maybe, or in W salt marsh. Where does salt marsh take place? At Marsh? I believe it's just kind of in the water. Okay, where where are you from? In to annihilation Jordan? What's the name of that place? Oh, it was no Carlos. I don't remember Carlos. Do you remember what it's called? I would have to look it up. Yeah, I do. We loosely said that your character was from Ahl Rua right land, magically wrong car, far, Far East from chalt I mean in general. There's plenty of locations and I'm not asking you guys to like memorize the map of tourl but if you managed to find a really high quality one of those, take some time and look through like there's some deep lower that's been created by the community over these years. I would like to see calum Shann come next, which is kind of it seems like a Arabia type setting. Votesandy, very ancient. There is an official well, not in official but there's a can calum Chan adventurers guide on DM skilled from empty black, who is one of these DM skilled creators who's just been elevated to absolute God's status by this point because of the range and absolute depth of his creations. So this is like it's heavily advertised on here. It's one of the best sellers on the site. I would love to see that in some official capacity and I'd love it if he was brought on to do it because it looks fantastic. That's a pretty big, pretty big place. It's crazy to think about right because, like only been dm me for such a short little while now and I feel like I've explored a lot of Cholt Bank. Look at the rest of the sort's coast path and it's massive. Yeah, it's why you gotta get to those higher levels, because there's definitely reasons why everything gets largely unexplored, as because nobody wants to travel out day. You know how to teleport. What do you mean walk? Yeah, what are you talking about? I can just pay for this, like stoll. This is it hasn't been sense. So I'm a rich monk just I want to pay for it. Yeah, first class ticket please, what the high quality teleport, the one that doesn't make my insides turn upside down. It on the other third. There's always space for flavor, guys. Absolutely, but without mind. Jordan. Yes, would you mind taking on the reins of this show and taking us to where are we going again? We are going to the abyss, guys. Oh Man, we're divining the DMG. We're going into page sixty two of the Dungeon Masters Guide. It's talking all about the outer planes, which are more of the spiritual realms and such. We've been through I think eight of them now so far and I'm going to try and do another four here so that next time we can get into the nine hells, which is going to be long one. But yeah, the abyss is probably the next longest one here and it's going to be awesome, guys. Okay, so the abyss is a chaotic evil, believe it or not. That's the alignment of it. I will read the small description here and then I'll kind of go over the optional rules and all the other stuff it has here for it. But yeah, so the abyss embodies all that is perverse, gruesome and chaotic. It's virtually endless layers spiral downward, evermore apart into evermore appalling forms. Each layer of the abyss boasts its own horrific environment,...

...although no two layers are alike, they are all harsh and inhospitable. Each layer also reflects the entropic nature of the abyss. In fact, much of what one sees or touches on the plane seems to be decaying, crumbling or in a corroded state. Not a place I'd want to be, guys. Vacation Party spot? Yeah, not so fun. So the abyss is optional. Rule here is corruption, which is everyone has to make DC ten charisma saving throws whenever they take a long rest there. If they fail, then they get a state of corruption. So, and there's four different states of that corruption, and I'll go over those in a second. If after they've been corrupted, they can make another DC fifteen charisma saving throw at the end of long rests rests. Sorry, and on a successful save or a dispel an evil and good spell, magic or something similar that removes curses can also end that. If a corruptly creature doesn't leave the plane within one day, four plus two days, it's alignment changes to chaotic evil as well. Again, the dispel evil and good spell can change or restore that creature to their original alignment. So, and those are for non evil visitors. So if you go to the abyss with an evil alignment, then you are fine. You won't become corrupted, which is kind of funny because I feel like the evil characters might actually enjoy some of this corruption. So the four different types here are treachery, blood lust, mad ambition and demonic possession. So treachery, the character gains this following flaw. I can only achieve my goals by making sure that my companions don't achieve their's blood lust is I enjoy killing for its own sake and once I start it's hard, it's hard to stop. Mad Ambition is I am destined to rule the abyss and my companions are tools to that end. And then demonic possession is really kind of interesting. The character is possessed by a demonic entity until freed by dispel evil, good or and good or similar magic. Whenever the possessed character rolls a one on an attack role and ability check or a saving throw, the demon takes control of that character and determines the characters behavior. At the end of each of the possessed characters turns, he or she can make a DC fifteen charisma saving throw on Xix. On a success, the character regains control until he or she rolls another one. I just want to just want to rewind a little bit to when you were talking about the the flaws and essential goals of the evil characters, and I kind of flip back to our conversation on the alignment chart. Yes, that description there, to me is something that should be shown to players with regards to character creation as well. We've had our discussion on the the alignment charts of anybody wants to listen to that. It's an one of our bonus actions in our previous episodes. But just to continue on the conversation, this is a much better definition of what an evil character is, because I find that, like a lot of characters or players might choose like, Oh, I'm going to be like a chaotic evil character because I want to be like an edgy and bad and like do bad things. But like the items you described are actual evil things, right. So if you don't align with that, then you not an evil character. And that's such a much clearer way of defining what evil characters are and do in game, right, because then you don't have to attach those those motives to any particular character race. Right, it's just if the motives of that person, of that creature are, you know, fall in line with this little box and you know you have yourself an evil character. And I think that, I would have been so much clearer for players initially, right, because like usually, even if you have like a character that's like, Oh, I'm trying to look for my own good but like you, you don't mind stepping on other people. Well, that's not really an evil character, right. That's just kind of a mutual character. But it's kind of hard to identify what what that little extra step is to make them evil. Right. I think it's in the players handbook when you are creating characters. In the I think it's chapter four character options where it goes over backgrounds and such. I think...

...it talks a little bit about ideals, bonds, flaws and something else, but I can't remember what that last thing is. Let me just look here for a quick second. Oh, personality traits. Okay, so I think in the in that section it actually goes over like different personality traits and ideals and bonds and such that you can choose as that character and it kind of gives you like Oh, if you choose this personality trait, this is more in line with waffle, or this is more in line with evil and this is more in line with neutral. Now, I've never really liked the whole like personality trace because I feel sometimes it can pigeonhole your character a little bit because and and it just doesn't quite match up with what I wanted my character to be. It's good for like ideas and I'll like flex it a little bit sometimes to to make it work towards my end, but usually I like I haven't found any situations where I've really wanted to be like, Oh yeah, that's an ideal or a bond or a flaw that I've really, really enjoyed and I really want to have on my character. Most of them just kind of seem a little bit vanilla. So I just I like trying different things. So like my edge Lord Bonds. Okay, well, no, but that's what I mean. Like even like the edge edgy stuff, like I find is kind of well vanilla. It's like yeah, okay, so then you to gods conversation, mostly rat the castle. Stop talk about this. sidetracked. My bad, but yeah, I do like this corruption stuff. It's kind of cool. Getting those different personality traits as a result of being in the abyss too long or or hat or failing these saving throws is a good idea. I like that. Yeah, the demonic possession one is really cool. To rolling a one to have it takeover is kind of interesting. It just kind of adds a little bit more flavor to that natural one. Oh knowness. I'll reiterate my usual stance, which is that I hate telling players how to play their characters. MMM, but this one has potential because I'm looking at this and I'm thinking back to a couple of things. One is critical role. HMM, in car I don't think you've seen this, Jordan, but Carlos will know what I'm talking about. In the first season, the character grog gets a sentient sword. Yes, and that sort it continues to grow and it has that blood lust to it. Yeah, it's a first. Is it about versions? It's not. Okay, it's just just a sentience or super evil sort got it and as he uses it, the more it's like it's not like you feel compelled, like you have to start doing this stuff, until it hurts a certain point and then it's like, Oh, you need to make a wisdom saving through, otherwise you're going to do this, because that's how right the swords become. Yes, it starts off as the DM really playing in towards how they think the character will respond to that and playing in towards it. This is the vibe and this is what the sword is telling you to do, and he does a great job of trying to tie it into what he already knows about the character, to exploit the character and the player to play the character in that way, which I think is amazing. I've been trying to weave that a little bit into what I'm doing because Jordan, in our campaign in as you very well know, you've recently picked up a somewhat wanted traveler inside your head in the full relatively evil entity, and I'd never tell you as and I've had that discussion with you, that I never tell you that you're now evil. Right, let you play the character however you want, but I am not hesitating to whenever there's a more difficult or great decision, I'm in the back of your head going like she's, she's in there telling you that to take the evil rote on this one. She's will let me you and characters and voices in your head. What's that? I don't know. Okay, you're weirdly susceptible to that, apparently. I mean, the first one was not my fault. The second one I kind of walked into it. You just the guy now, you just yeah, I with multiple voices and spars. Yeah, apparently one brain is not enough for me. Yeah, okay, so I'm going to quickly move on here. Sorry to cut a short. They're a little bit but I they goes on here in the abyss to talk about the different important layers of the abyss. So there is an infinite number...

...of them, but there are certain ones that are considered important specifically for the rulers of them. So there's the gaping maw, which is the Demo gorgans layer. Basically it's a twisted, massive primeval continent covered in dense jungle, surrounded by seemingly endless expanse of ocean and brine flats. He rules the Demogorgrin, the Prince of demons, rules from two different towers, to Serpentine Towers. Each tower is topped with an enormous Fang skull and it kind of like plays off of the Demo gorgans to different split personality or he. I looked up the monster in the monster manual a little bit just to get a better idea of what it's talking about here, and the Demo Gorgan has two heads on it. Each of them are mad and they fight against each other almost constantly. It kind of remember reminds me of I think Janus is the I think it's Roman or Greek. Yeah, he's the rotating head. He. Yeah, it has the two heads, two different personalities, basically, and they just they fight against each other all the time, and so that's the only thing, apparently, that's holding back the Demogorgan from our listeners that are more inclined towards stranger things. This is not the same demig organ. Yeah, not the same, unfortunately. I do believe that does exist within the DD cannon. Now, yeah, I think. Yeah, I think the Demo Gorgan from stranger things is closer to a mind flare. Maybe. I'm not sure. No, no, maybe, no, different, different creature, but different sature. I don't know. Yeah, so different, different Demigorgan, though, definitely for this. Okay, another layer that's important here, for the abyss is then a toast which is run by orchis. He basically controls and undead realm, and everything here is bleak, howling wastelands called the oblivion's end. Just everything is dead here, basically, and if ORCAS had his way, all realms would be like this and all creatures would be part of his undead army. That's kind of his goal, at least that's from what I'm reading. Here you've got the Demon Webb, which is loath slayer, which is an immense network of magical webbing. I think it's really cool. They go on to describe a little bit about how the webbing kind of like has random portals throughout it and so things end up there from the different Demi planes and the material planes and it's kind and it's also used at the same time by the Spider Queen Servants to to build and to have like underground passage ways and ways of getting to and front places without being noticed. It's kind of interesting. It talks a little bit of more. It's as far beneath these dungeons lies the bottomless demon web pits where the Spider Queen actually dwells, where she's surrounded by her handmaiden's the Yolklaw, which apparently outrank mightier demons, specifically when in the Spider Queen's realms. Yes, creepy, yeah, yeah, yeah. I've always found wealth super fascinating and the roster general species super fascinating. Yes, I'm still I'm very against the idea of labeling races as evil specifically, but I do I do like the draw in the whole vibe at the draw in this whole kind of underground community. The this will matriarchal community devout to the spider goddess. Hmm, I love it. Yeah, we got the endless maze. Here is another layer. The endless rate maze is baffomets. It's a basically a never ending dungeon which holds the horned kings enormous Zigarette Palace, which is a confusing jumble of cricket hallways, a myriad of chambers, and the Palace is surrounded by a mild wide moat concealing a maddening series of submerge stairs, tunnel and tunnels leading deeper into the...

...fortress. It's just confusing, sounds like, but he's puzzle Q. Yeah, yeah, it's also a great place if you want to like leave someone to just kind of rot for a while. You know, it's chuck them there. The triple realm is the dark prince gradst Gras just I don't know how to pronounce that. Seems like all unnecessary apostrophe. Yeah, Gr so, for those listening, it's Gra Zed atrophe Z T grass it gras. It's yeah, it's super weird. He rolled over this realm which encompasses three different layers. His seats of power is the fantastic argent palace. Oh, so this place is bustling with a market place and, like the pleasures of the palaces, kind of draws visitors from the multiverse, mostly in skier, in search of obscure magical lore or perverse delights. So this is, I guess, the place that you'd want to end up in if you were going to the the abyss. So there is kind of some sort of civility here at least, but people can go missing and it's not like people are going to care there. So the last place that it goes on to describe for the abyss as a an important place is the death Del's which is, you know, goose. He rules this layer and it has basically creatures here have to hunt and survive, even the plants, which much which must bathe their roots in blood and snare the unwary. Yeah, it's it's it's about sating hunger and I guess eating and feasting on all things not exactly one place I'd want to go. So far sounds like. Yeah, the abyss, everyone, I find it interesting. I can't remember. I'm not it's not like I've memorized the Demon Lords off the top of my head. HMM. But the one that does stick out to me, I've been because I've been even research on it, is for my campaign, is Pazoozu and he's a Hu's demon Lord that has particular significance to the whole lore of the DD pant and he's responsible from creating the devil king as Modius. MMM. He's a very important figure. So I'm surprised that they wouldn't include him and his realm in the the abyss or in the nine house, because those are two different spots. He's a he's a demon Lord, though not a not one of the devil's. Okay, I think he would belong in the abyss. Hmm, I am not sure, but as a very interesting point, I will try and look that up. But I'm starting to run out a time here, so I'm gonna quickly go through the next couple ones here. So first we've got car story, which is the model for all other prisons in existence. Car Story is a plane of desolation and despair. It's six layers hold vast bogs, feted jungles, windswept deserts, jagged mountains, frigid oceans and black ice all form a miserable home for traders and backstabbers that are trapped on this prison plane. So the optional rule for K car sory is no one can leave car story easily. Magical efforts to leave the plane by any spell other than a wish simply fail. Portals and gates that open onto the plane become one way only. There are secret ways out of the plane, but they are hidden and well guarded by traps and deadly monsters. That is awesome, car storr, is so cool. It's right to you that I've looked up in advance of this, because it does exist within the world of my homebrew campaign. The one twist. I don't think it's too much of a spoiler for you, Jordan, who's the person that listens to this. It's like, I don't think it's a too much of a spoiler to say that I've kind of taken the idea of cars right being the perspect prison to an extreme, to the idea that anyone who sent there there is a cell specifically made to hold them. MMM, everybody has their own very specific cell that's meant specifically to counter any escape from them. In particular, a how not not not torturous specifically, but in a scipable, completely and utterly inescapable. Cool.

You have to become someone else to escape and interesting thought. HMM, cool. Quickly moving on once again, had he's is the next realm here. So hadis is, has has sorry is the three glooms. They are places without joy, hope or passion. It's a gray land with an ashen sky. Haiti's is the destination of many souls that are unclaimed by the Gods of the upper plains or the fiendish rulers of the lower planes. These souls become larvae and spend eternity in this place that lacks a sun, a moon, stars or seasons, leaching away color and emotion. This gloom is more than most visitors can stand. The shadow fell despair rule, rule earlier in this chapter can be used to represent a visitor's despair, which I think you talked about a little bit, Braden. There's also another optional rule here called the vile transformation, which is when you take a long rest, you have to make a DC ten wisdom saving throw. On a failed save, the creature gains one level of exhaustion which can't be removed. While the creature remains on Haitis. If the creature reaches six levels of exhaustion, it doesn't die. Instead, that creature permanently transforms into a larva, whereupon all levels of exhaust afflicting the creature are removed. A larva is a remove miserable fiend that retains the facial features of the previous form but has the body of a fat worm. Larva has only a few faint memories of its previous life, and the statistics are here as well for it. Hades is just crawling with these larvae, and then all the other creatures that live here, like night hags, lytches and Rakshasas harvest them for vile rituals or feed on them. But how scary would that be? There's a really cool game that I have, a PC game called the void, and the concept of the void is that you're essentially it's not quite clear if it's hell or if it's limbo or what, but you die and you end up in this place and the entire point is your drained of color. It's a completely black and white world and if you have color you're able to retain your sentience and your personality. But as you explore this world you're slowly and insteadily leach of it until you become essentially your body wilts and transforms into one of these devilition denizens of this place called the void. And if that's not directly based on this description of Hades, I would be floored. This place, the fact that it leaches away color and emotion everybody that spends time here until they eventually become one of these lava. That's so. That is a one to one comparison to this game. I love it. I love it so much it's great. I did forget to say the alignments of Car Surai and Haiti's. So carsway is neutral evil and chaotic evil, and Haiti's is just neutral evil, which makes sense carser. I always confuse me. I always figured car Sur I would be almost a true neutral place just because it is a price it is, but I guess it's specifically for a miserable home for the traders and backstabbers that are trapped on this prison plane. So I guess it's because of the people who live there more so than the actual place itself, or at least that's my guess. Get Henna is the last place I want to talk about today. It is a neutral evil lawful evil plane. Gehenna is the plane of suspicion and greed. It is the birthplace of the Yugo lofts, which dwell here in great numbers. Of Volcanic Mountain dominates each of the four layers of Gehenna. A lesser volcanic and lesser volcanic Earth Birds Drift in the air and smash into the Greater Mount Pins. The rocky slopes of the plane make movement here difficult and dangerous. The ground inclines at least forty five degrees almost everywhere. In places, steep cliffs and deep canyons present more challenging obstacles. Hazards include volcanic fissures that vaunt vent nauseous fumes or searing flames. Get Hannah has no room for mercy or compassion. The fiends living here are amongst the greediest and most...

...selfish in all the multiverse. The optional rule here is cruel hindrance. The planes cruel nature makes it difficult for visitors to help one another. Whenever a visitor cast a spell with a beneficial effect, including a spell that restores hit points or removes a condition, that castor must first make a DC ten charisma saving throw on a failed Save, the spell fails, the spell slot is expended and the action is wasted. I just I just had to look at huglof because I've never heard of this before, but it's just add just as an extra little thing to to this plane. Could we add your sock is always wet. But it essentially says that the Jugulass were believed to have been deep pupping masters behind the blood war, which is essentially demons versus devils. So the the fact that they live in a place where it's all about suspicion and greed, like, all about looking out for yourself over others, seems super fitting. HMM. Yeah, and I can't believe a forty five degree inclines everywhere. Guys, that seems like a workout going be toned F by the time you get off this twin. Yeah, but I think that is all for me for today. Thanks for listening everyone, and I'm going to hand it over to Braden to take over for the next part. For sure. Before I jump into that. This episode of triple advantage brought to you by the College of enchantment, a Spartic subclass available now on DM's guild from our lead writer, Matt Newman, and the Royal City Society. If you ever wanted to play as a bard who is able to work their innate magical whispering and whatnot into actually enchanting items, into turning items into temporary magical items, definitely something that I would recommend checking out. It comes with a full subclass as well as a list of different enchantments that you can view your items with on those class it is available now for pay what you want on DM skill. Check out the link in our bio on any of our social media pages. But for now let's move on to our segment, talk of the town, where we reach out to you, the society, with a question that's been we've been pondering and we like to see what you out there were thinking. So this week's question is, what's a villain that you've played that really stood out as an amazing villain and why? What made this particular villain so enthralling for you? I can go first on this one, I guess. So that's a super interesting question, I guess you. I would first want to like to find villain, and you know because you because you're asking why. Why do I think like a villain would be a good villain, and there's all kinds of different good villains. Like is the villain like super evil, and so it got me like stoked up to really want to like murder him because, you know, or is it just like a good villain because he was so difficult to take down and he was playing the long game? Or is really strategic? So there's all kinds of different like good villains that you could have out there. Right I think my favorite so far has been, I think Joba from your campaign, Braden. He was just everywhere, he had his hand in everything. It was just really like, I don't know, he was kind of like a kingpin of the town and it was just great to like kind of take that guy down because, I don't know, I felt great because he had his hand everywhere and it seems like he had infinite resources comparatively to us. So I enjoyed the more strategic, long term villains, but if I can get like really stoked up and really mad at a particular guy, I obviously love taking those guys down too. So I know a few people have really and from our campaigns I've really talked about murdering this one particular person that pissed them off a few times. I've only interacted with that person a few like one time, I think, so I'm not that invested in it as as a person, so it's not my favorite. Right now in my campaign I'm running a almost a more neutral character,...

...but the players absolutely hate her. It's great. I just had our be a more pompous and like smug person who wasn't really going to help them, and so they just instantly took a disliking to her and they they you know, won't stop talking about how much they like hate this person. So it's great creating that rival for them just kind of get them emotionally invested, and I think that makes a good villain. I'm going to put a pinion something you said, Jordan, because it's tenses on what a lot of our listener said, but we'll get back to that. Carlos, what do you think about this? Anything you describe too much? My answer is it's because it choke. This would be but adore something. I think what makes a good villain is what you the time that you put into crafting one, the time that the players have exposed to them, because I think in the longest campaign that I've been the two of an elation campaign that I've been running. YOU GUYS HAVE GONE FROM VILLAINS TO VILLAINS, but there hasn't been, you know, one large villain, largely just this tomb. You know loosely that it was made for somebody at this point, right, and you, some of you have a name, some of you have an inkling, but it's been sort of touched upon a very roundabout manner. That I don't think has been a big driving factor for you to party right. You know, we're not going to defeat bad guy a you know. So it's been interesting sort of work with the villain of a story in this campaign and I think it's been like those moments where we get down to the nitty gritty and, you know, I'm starting to describe these enemies and at least a response that I've seen from you guys is, you know, more investment in the combat, both in descriptions from what you guys are doing versus, you know, the Medusa. Initially it was a little bit built up, but it ended so quickly the first time that it wasn't really you know, you didn't have the time to sing that your teeth into the villain itself, or at least for that little dungeon. And unfortunately that module doesn't doesn't tug you along, you know, with the acts of somebody like you said, Jordan, you know, has their hands and fingers and pockets and, you know, tied and they just pulled the masterminds strings across. I don't think I've haven't had the chance to run a character like that. So, HMM, my answer goes back to I think just the more you describe the an antagonist in the situation right like, that's what makes them good, makes a players care for because if the players don't care for the villain, then it's they might be extremely, extremely bad and extremely evil, but if a pairs don't care, ultimately right, they don't exist in your story, so they wouldn't be in here. It's a bit of a roundabout answer, but it's unfortunately, because I haven't really had chance to run many villains that I enjoyed from movies and TV's. Obviously we have like plenty to choose from, but that's not original contents. Yeah, I'll leave it at that for now. I I'm reaching way back for this one, but one of my favorite villains is, he was less of a villain and more of just like an aggressive thorn in the side of my party. And this was actually a campaign that both of you were in. It was the first campaign I ever ran, the first homebrew that I did, and there was a particular nobleman named Lord Valentine, and he had originally hired the players the party to complete a task for him, which was essentially a cleaning a very possessive, demonic plant entity out of his garden. But afterwards, after they had done this, he paid them for what they were promised. But he revealed that, like, I'm actually like the the king, because of what I've said, has taken a shining to you. You're officially working for the king now you don't have a choice. Yeah, essentially just completely Shang hide the party into into constrict conscripted service for the king because that's what he felt like doing. And the best, one of the best moments I think I've ever had in a campaign during that first encounter where you lot were clearing out this demonic entity, one of our players died,...

...one of the player characters died, and I was the first time I've ever fill the air. Yeah, exactly, so and this was the first time, I think, I think it was the first time any of you had played in a party where character and died. So it was one of our very early campaigns. Yeah, he dispatches you on this next quest and as he goes to leave, he's about to leave through the door and he turns back and he goes, oh, try not to get anybody killed on this one, and he walks out and I distinctly remember our group Palettin. He's says, I stand up, I pulled my sword out and I throw it as hard as I can at the or after him, and I was like it was just such a visceral outburst of like raw anger from this both this player and this player character, and I just like felt, oh, that's right, it felt so good. But I think that that ties into what our society talked about and what you mentioned already, Jordan. I'm going to read a couple of responses that we had here, because on our twitter, on our instagram and on our discord discussion, I had one pervasive thing that came up over and over again on our instagram. First a look at it. Our friend the GUT to power plant responded with an individual that he played named Martin Salmon Salmond. Martin Salmond, a pompous novel. He was not the Bebeg big that evil guy, but the players love to hate him. Yeah, on twitter we had it's gone. Where is it? There we go. We had at monsters underscore multi respond jar laxel, who is the main antagonist in water deep dragonheist, and they say that they taught him, or sorry, he taught them a lot about how to make a true villain, because this individual made him a true foil to the party and just built him oute over time until he was absolutely despised by the entire Party, until he says, thwarting him was a catharsis for them. HMM. And in our discord discussion our good friend Alex, member of the royals, a society place. Actually, you're in this campaign as well, Jordan. Yeah, there's a certain baron son who's overly proficient at being an asshole. Very Fun knowing he's not going to be doing it for so long. There is something about crafting a villain and crafting it well to the point where your players absolutely hate that villain, where it's not just this is what the quest tells us to do so we're going to do it. It's not just we've been giving the job by the king, so we're going to go kill this guy. It's it's both the characters and the players themselves absolutely despise this individual with every fiber of their being now to the point where it's Cathartic when you finally get to see them die or get to see them get their come up. It's yes, I think. I don't know, I don't make a lot of villains I like. I like to play in a very great world, especially now that my party has gone into kind of murder Hobo territory. But I think that being able to craft a villain that's just universally hated is an art form. HMM, you're going to have to start getting heroes REAC campaign that's universally hate. The others, everybody but the party. Yeah, besides that, we had some good responses in our discord. Server B Rad user. Brad said keep ran a campaign in industrialized setting where his main villain, doctor thelonious drake, was a scientist obsessed with evolving the human race. So they never ended up finding this villain, but they found a lot of his twisted experiments were they were thinking. It sounds like they were thinking like they were fighting monsters but in reality they were actually killing other humans that had been twisted by these experiments and that that was going to be this big reveal once the players and inkling because they were finding his research notes on all of this. But it sounds like he was building up to this big reveal of like you're the monsters all along, Zaha, which is always a fun reveal. We also had from user, can you do the Cam Cam on discord of the name, by the way, that he played a villain where essentially the bad guys were eat seven evil wizards based on the seven deadly sins. But one of the bad guys was revealed to be the leader of the local major's guild that several of the parties were members of. So it was a moment where they had trusted this individual, they had gotten to know this NPC quite well and then he flipped around basically later into this campaign. I was like,...

...surprise, I'm the evil guy all along. Let's throw that Nice. Always, always a fun surprise moment. I love peppering. That was in as well and going back over to our twitter at LF underscore os or responded with Lord soft, who I did not know, but I looked it up and it looks like he's a very iconic character from the Dragon Lance Setting, which has been, I'm never quite sure of Dragon Lances official dd but it sounds like it's one of those third party things that's become basic cannon because of his legendary status. He was a fictional palette and it sounds like a knight of the black rose who became this very, very antagonistic character, this very evil character. He's been named as one of the greatest villains in DD history by the now defunct Dragon magazine, which is no small feat for sure. I don't know a ton about him, but I kind of want to. After reading some of these some of these descriptions, seems like a lot of people love to hate this guy. So I like to read into what makes them such a good villain. But love to hate, love to hate. That's that's the lesson to take away pass its. Unfortunately, that does bring us to the end of this episode of triple advantage. If you'd like to be on our next talk of the town, stay tuned to our instagram, our twitter, our discord server would will be asking the next question. In the meantime, keep an eye out for releases, for any new products that one of them should be coming out very soon. I don't want to I don't want to spoil what's coming up with. There's something coming out very soon that I think people are really going to like, especially with a Halloween writer around the corner. Yeah, so in the meantime, take it easy, stay safe and we'll catch you next time.

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